Space:Time Men's LED Watch?

[Bad Juju]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230394792604&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123#ht_2664wt_1133

I searched but couldn't find anything on this forum (or on the web either) about this watch. Who has one? Display quality? Worth getting for a daily watch?

[azimuth_pl]

the forum is mostly about vintage LEDs.
this one is modern knock-off from China.
worth maximum 50$

[Bad Juju]

Azimuth, thanks for the reply. For the last four or five months I have been absorbing tons of information available from this forum. I admire both your knowledge and your willingness to share it. I have already learned much from you and others.

Under the link to the LED Watches forum the main forum index states "MODERN and VINTAGE". While I realize that most of the content of this forum is about vintage LEDs, I thought that this would be the best place to ask this question. I know that there are several "modern knock-offs" available. I was just wondering if anyone had experience with this particular model. I know... it was a long shot.

I don't have an extensive collection of LED watches (only a couple P2s, a P3, and a Trafalgar). I was looking for an LED that would be a good daily watch.

Thanks again for your reply. That is good information to know. I have found that I can get this watch for ~$25. Just in case anyone else cares... I'll post a review after I have worn/used the watch for a little while.

Oh, by the way... I really enjoy your websites (old and new revision).

[azimuth_pl]

hi Shaun,
thanks for the additional explanation.
this is the place to ask question however most users will have expertease on the old stuff unless they buy something new to play with.
these are pretty new LEDs from China without any brand indication so knowledge about them is limited.
the quality to be expected is so-so and longterm reliability is unknown.
more can be said about modern LEDs from TokyoFlash or other popular sites that sell topgrade LEDs.

my website has become a real pain :)
I never expected that amount of work so this will take a while... a longer while.

[Bad Juju]

more can be said about modern LEDs from TokyoFlash or other popular sites that sell topgrade LEDs.

TokyoFlash makes nice watches. They used to make a drivers watch that I like but of course it is discontinued and no one has them any more. I don't care for most of their designs, though. Majestyk's watches are growing on me. I might try one of his one day.

my website has become a real pain :) I never expected that amount of work so this will take a while... a longer while.

Well, I like what you have done so far. I know how it is about not having time for "extracurricular" stuff. The really fun stuff takes a lot of work. I have several projects that I want to work on but with one and a half year old twins at home I really don't have time for anything... I guess they will get older and more self sufficient one day. The problem there is that they are so much fun at this age and I will miss it when it is gone. <sigh> Life, I guess.

[azimuth_pl]

here is Ed's review on the TF Driver LED... huge watch:
http://www.thedigitalwatch.com/Archives/MOM_003.htm

[abem]

I've been kind of curious about these too, mainly because they use a real LED display rather than the LED backlit LCD displays that are found on almost all "retro" LED watches like the LIP revivals or the zillions of retro LEDs that you see on eBay. Also, these are available in a variety of colors - red, blue, green and yellow (purple would be nice).

It looks like at least the display and possibly the module is the same as that used on the Modern Watches LIP knock-offs that Ed reviewed a while back - can anyone confirm this? If so, then at least the display uses a wire-bonded type construction with discrete light emitting diode elements. Ed describes the display as "gloriously bright, like an early Pulsar or Hamilton on steriods!!":
http://www.thedigitalwatch.com/Archives/MOM_006.htm

From several of the photos that I've seen it looks like the positioning of the diodes is a bit imprecise. Also, it would be nice if the display used a colon between the digits rather than a dot. Still, they seem like they would be worth checking out and could be enjoyable for the color and brightness alone.

If someone has one of these and could post some photos, that might be interesting. It might also be useful to know if the modules used in these watches can be used in older style cases without too much modification. Would it be blasphemy to attach a couple of reed switches and retrofit these to old Pulsar cases? A retrofitted Pulsar's still better than a dead Pulsar, right?

-abe.

[azimuth_pl]

as far as I'm aware only Bronex and Pulsar Spoon used backlit LCD's.
many of the early modern LEDs from AD2000 are pretty much identical to late 70's Asian LEDs with very small diodes covered with bubble lenses.
many of the current production might seem to be LCD due to the thickness of the digits but they contain standard SMD LEDs covered with a mask.

[J Thomas]

[Bad Juju]

If I purchase one (and I'm really considering it) I will take it apart and post pics with my review. However, I don't have much experience with old modules and cases so I wouldn't know what, if anything, these new modules would fit into. Actually, I can add measurements and the number/locations of buttons, too.

EDIT:

Hi Abe, I bought the set of four (red,green, blue, yellow) in a moment of stupidity on ebay, and despite a raging case of buyers remorse, I just could not bring myself to sending them back and asking for a refund.

I did do an "alien autopsy" on the blue and red models. It was a huge module, poorly assembled, and operated on a pair of lithium 2025's stacked. The red one as I remember used just one battery (makes sense because of the operating voltage for blue LED's).

The front side of the fr4 board was direct attach individual led die, with exposed wire bonds. They were huge die, and had two LED's per segment, so they looked nothing like the displays of old. The backside was an epoxy blob over a COB die attach, plus a few random discrete components. Pretty much like the guts of a McDonalds happy meal toy opened up.

The case finishing and band craftsmanship is what you'd expect for a $25 LED watch today. It took a few months for the hair to grow back on my wrist after a couple days wearing them. Downright painful.

Sorry I did not take photos. Prior to this thread I probably would have denied ever buying them

Regards, Jeff

OK, maybe I WON'T get one. This is the kind of info I was looking for. Thanks!

Jeff, did you buy them a month or so ago? I saw a listing for four that sold last month.

[abem]

Here's an example of an LED backlit LCD - the LIP Mach 2000 Revival. If you look closely, you can see the LEDs behind the LCD digits (also, it's described as an LED backlit LCD in the manual). The display can be hard to read at times because there is small distance between the LEDs and the LCD forming the digits so if you're not viewing it from the right angle, the parallax causes problems.

LED Backlit LCD under favorable lighting:

LED Backlit LCD under not-so-favorable lighting:


This watch is typically French. It's really beautiful and stylish but it can be a bit hard to read and the design makes no sense. You have to push a recessed button in order to view the date and seconds. What were they thinking?

-abe.

[azimuth_pl]

interesting, that would mean that all of the modern LEDs with similar displays are LCDs with SMD LEDs. Majestyk for instance.
however the display looks rather like a SMD LED with mask on top that prevents the light from one segment to protrude to other segments.
can you see the liquid crystal panel if you look at an angle?

btw. LIP has been defunct since the late 70's when the social labor unions went on strike and killed the company. the modern ones are Asian makes by a company which bought the label.

[rewolf]

Are you sure this LIP is a backlit LCD? It looks rather like the type of modern LED J Thomas described above.

(Edit: azimuth_pl was faster...)
Majestyk is definitely NOT backlit LCD, but an example of a very well-made modern LED display. I know for sure, I have all 4 variants and of course I disassembled them as I do with any electronic device I get in my hands

[retroleds]

I'm questioning whether ABE actually took the LIp module out and examined (this might mean disassembly). The Lips I had in hand, much like the Majestyk watch, were board mounted square LED units, one per segment. Above those is a thin(1-2mm) plastic piece with holes in the precise shape of your 7 segments. Then a piece of thin colored plastic further obscures the hotter/brighter center point of each segment, The Majestyk is really bright without that plastic(I personally liked it that way), but again, the segments do have more of a "brite dot in the middle of a rectangle" effect, visually. No LCDs involved, whatsoever.

Tangentially , those Bench and DKNY OLED watches(like SUlly and I have been Frankenstiening in to Pulsars) are an LED Matrix display, akin to an LCD display in construction - the glass matrix has a "zebra strip" of contacts along one side, but connected to a flexible ribbon cable.

[azimuth_pl]

the Majestyk is not a backlit LCD but since the LIP is made in the same fashion and the manual describes it as such then why not throw all such modules into this new category?
SMD LED with segment filter... IMO, Ed described it in more detail.

[abem]

All,

Interesting. I must confess, I haven't taken it apart (yet). Ed's description is exactly right on - there is obviously a plastic filter which partially works as a diffiuser for the diodes. Now I'm doubting that there is an LCD involved since that would diminish the brightness considerably. I stand corrected.

The verbage in the manual reads as follows:

A. Features
* 4 Digits LCD Display
* Normal TIme: Hour (12/24 Hour), Minutes and Seconds
* Calendar: Month and Date
* LED back light with 3-5 seconds delay

Of course, that doesn't mean a whole lot since people tend to throw around the terms LED and LCD interchangeably.

Either way, SMD LED and LED backlit LED both pale in comparison with real 70's style LED displays. LEDs rule. LCDs drool (leak).

-abe.

[Bad Juju]

Well, the lot of four watches (one of each color LED) came and went yesterday. I was going to go ahead and get them at the starting bid of $99.99 but after Jeff's review I decided against it.

So I've been looking into a few other "retro" LEDs. Majestyk's design hasn't grown on me enough yet. For a daily wearer I am considering:
the Space LED Watch for $99.99
the Zeon for $149.00
the Eagle SS for $99.00
or the TokyoFlash Retrofit for $199.00

So far I am leaning towards the Space LED Watch. I like the P3ish looks even though it has bar/segment LEDs rather than dots.

I'll have to do a little more research before I decide. Whatever I end up with I will post a review with photos and measurements.

[J Thomas]

[retroleds]

Maybe the Eagle is your best bet. It has real wirebonded LEDs, but magnifiers over them which give that marginally fish-eyed look. I am basing this suggestion off the earlier Eagle LEDs, which had the same module as the Fossill 2002 series.

Every time I see Zeon I think of their Solsuno watch
http://www.ledwatchstop.com/store/watch ... -p-40.html

[Bad Juju]

Jeff, thanks for the welcome. Maybe one of these days I will take a chance on the Space:Time LEDs. It wouldn't be the first watch that I've owned to denude my wrist. I liked the Space:Time originally because of the dot display but the only reason I was going to buy the lot of four is because that is the only way they will sell the red one. I suppose the other colors aren't selling as well.

OLEDs are cool but for now I want a traditional display. I'm a new collector so I am partial to the 70's look at this time. Unlike the veteran collectors I'm not necessarily looking for something new.

I am still leaning towards the Space LED Watch. The description on the website is doing a good job of luring me in with passages like this:

"We use modern and highly reliable digital watch modules fitted with the original 70s type seven segment self illuminating digits that are wire bonded by the manufacturer to the modern module. The result is a great combination of absolutely authentic 70s LED watch look and feel with the reliability and long life of highly accurate modern electronics."

[bucko170]

Why not just opt for an original 70s LED watch as a daily wear? Ed has a nice range available at $120 or less on his site at http://www.retroleds.com/
Why spend your money on a modern day 'pretend' 70s LED when you can have the real thing?

[Bad Juju]

For a daily wearer I am considering:
the Space LED Watch for $99.99
the Zeon for $149.00
the Eagle SS for $99.00
or the TokyoFlash Retrofit for $199.00

And the winner is... NONE of the above!



Azimuth directed me to THIS and I grabbed it! I have been scanning the PULSAR listings almost daily for months but in the past couple weeks I have gotten out of the habit of checking the non-Pulsar LED listings. A while back I had considered a NOS Commodore or a NOS Armitron but I really found their form factor to be bit big and clunky.

Bucko, excellent suggestion. I did take (another) look at Retro LEDs but the exact same NOS Compu Chron there was ~$100 more. I almost feel like I stole the watch from the eBay seller.

Thank you to all for your reviews, suggestions, and advice!